So ... about that nuclear power, monkeybutter ...

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Re: So ... about that nuclear power, monkeybutter ...

Postby Nathan » Tue Mar 15, 2011 10:57 pm

monkeybutter wrote:fuck, they're evacuating most of the workers, this isn't a good sign.

the 80 people they're leaving behind basically volunteered to die so that they might continue to try to save their country from a really ugly incident. godspeed, dudes.


Yeah, it's awful. Though I think your news is a bit old -- I heard they'd evacuated the workers yesterday. The 40-50 dudes left behind are fucked. What the hell can they even do at this point?
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Re: So ... about that nuclear power, monkeybutter ...

Postby Eagle » Wed Mar 16, 2011 5:21 am

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Re: So ... about that nuclear power, monkeybutter ...

Postby monkeybutter » Tue Mar 22, 2011 10:06 am

so it looks like it's all settling down.

so what have we learned here?

A cluster of 6 40-year old reactors with histories of poor maintenance gets hit by both the worst earthquake and the worst tsunami in japanese recorded history and, although it was touch & go for a bit, the end result is that some plant workers have likely received doses of radiation that will kill them in not too much time, and there seems to be a moderate amount of released radioactive fallout settling on some agricultural products in the vicinity, enough to pose a question of whether the produce is safe to eat, but not enough to make it definitely hazardous. And it's not like they were far away from the earthquake - they were like 80 miles from the epicenter, which is basically right on top of it.

And that's it. It's not the nonevent Three Mile Island was, but considering the events leading up to it, this should really drive home how safe nuclear power is.

While we're still waiting for the full picture, I'll just note that worldwide, to date 73 people died from wind power. That's 73 more people who have ever died in a nuclear power accident occurring in the western world where we make our power plants with actual containment walls - ie, discounting chernobyl.
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Re: So ... about that nuclear power, monkeybutter ...

Postby Shawn Richter » Tue Mar 29, 2011 10:33 am

MB, I'm not trying to make light of your stats, but I did kind of laugh out loud from this...

I'll just note that worldwide, to date 73 people died from wind power.


...it's jsut so bizarre. Of course, I also pictured it happening, (Riding mower, listening to headphones, oops!) and because I am a bad, bad man, it gave me a giggle. So, yeah, I'd get onboard with nuclear, as long as they decomission the old shitty ones...
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Re: So ... about that nuclear power, monkeybutter ...

Postby monkeybutter » Tue Mar 29, 2011 2:22 pm

hundreds of pounds of metal and fiberglass spinning out of control? what could go wrong?!



the brakes failed in a strong wind and the rotors can't be built to withstand those kinds of forces, so it just flies apart, scattering big hunks of steel hundreds of yards. This is doublebad because sometimes they'll take out other windmills, although they try to position them so this wont happen.

most of the people were killed like this or by a tower falling on them or falling off a tower or some garbage like that.
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Re: So ... about that nuclear power, monkeybutter ...

Postby Thor Badendyck » Mon Apr 11, 2011 12:09 pm

monkeybutter wrote:hundreds of pounds of metal and fiberglass spinning out of control?

sounds like those windmills should've been upgraded to modern safety standards. why can't hundreds of pounds of metal and fiberglass spin under control? we do build airplanes that aren't usually the giant gruesome death inducers they seem like - but occasionally are, yet we constantly use anyway.

monkeybutter wrote:most of the people were killed like this or by a tower falling on them or falling off a tower or some garbage like that.

for comparison, what are the stats on people killed in mundane, unsensational ways at nuclear plants?

anyway, updates...
http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/meast/04/11/japan.nuclear.reactors/
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Re: So ... about that nuclear power, monkeybutter ...

Postby monkeybutter » Tue Apr 12, 2011 10:28 am

Thor Badendyck wrote:sounds like those windmills should've been upgraded to modern safety standards. why can't hundreds of pounds of metal and fiberglass spin under control?


the blades are like 20 feet long, they're really strong but building them to withstand those kinds of centrifugal forces would be cost-prohibitive.

we do build airplanes that aren't usually the giant gruesome death inducers they seem like - but occasionally are, yet we constantly use anyway.


I'm not sure what you're saying here. I'm not making an argument that wind power shouldn't be used, I'm making the point that with every activity comes risk.

for comparison, what are the stats on people killed in mundane, unsensational ways at nuclear plants?


I looked around for this and couldn't find anything, if you can please post it.




Yeah, it's gotten really bad. It'll be entombed and made into a nature preserve.

I haven't been following it very closely, but i get the sense that for far too long they were treating it like they could still salvage the plant itself instead of saying "holy shit this is bad, do whatever needs to be done to shut it down." Many books will be written and much political hay will be made.
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Re: So ... about that nuclear power, monkeybutter ...

Postby monkeybutter » Tue Apr 12, 2011 10:31 am

also a quick reminder re: anything greenpeace has to say: they're impossibly biased and have a long track record of being wildly off-base in their predictions, at least when it comes to the hard sciences.

I know they're the good guys and stuff, but they're seemingly just as willing to bend the truth to serve their goals as their opponents when it comes to things like this.
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Re: So ... about that nuclear power, monkeybutter ...

Postby Bill Farmer » Mon Apr 18, 2011 9:04 pm

This is a pretty good interview with Dr. Michio Kaku about the developments at the Fukushima Daiichi Nuclear Power Plant. I am not as smart as some of you all who debate on here but I hope I am smart enough to identify the smart people. I never really put much thought into nuclear power before this. I did know that it produces a waste and could become a serious disaster if got out of hand. I assumed that safety precautions were in place to prevent anything as bad as Chernobyl accident from happening. I understand that this event has only placed about a 10th of the nuclear contamination into the environment as Chernobyl from reports so far and there wasn't a substantial explosion sending reactor material high into the atmosphere like Chernobyl. My concerns are that Fukushima accident isn't over. Not all of the available information has been released by TEPCO. The structures housing the reactors are in very bad shape, and there is still a forecasted 8.0 aftershock looming that could possibly damage the already severely damaged structures even more.

I was all about nuclear power, but I thought it was safer now, that the geniuses in charge have learned from mistakes. It seems only common sense to not light a fire that can't go out on it's own in the event you aren't there to extinguish it. The mentality feels more like a cross between arrogance and recklessness.

I would like to thank the Palo Verde Nuclear Power Plant for providing me with the electricity so I could post this rant. My heart goes out to the Japanese people. I hope people can learn from this event, and improve.


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Re: So ... about that nuclear power, monkeybutter ...

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